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GR Showdown: Is The Wii U's Future In Trouble?

Posted on Friday, March 1 @ 17:20:00 Eastern by GR_Staff


GR Showdown pits the Game Revolution staff against each other in a passionate debate on a particular hot-button gaming topic. Our self-imposed rules? There is no middle groundall must take a side. All debates will have an equal number of representative on both sides: either 1-on-1 or 2-on-2 . And all our arguments must be made in 350 words or fewer; 500 or fewer, if it's 1-on-1. Which side are YOU on?

This Week's Topic: Is The Wii U's Future In Trouble?


Nick Tan - YES: Don't be swayed by Nintendo fanboys. They like to sweep any criticism of the Wii U by saying that it's trendy to hate on the Wii U and that it's all just "doom and gloom". Sounds like something a cult would say.

The Wii survived due to the motion gaming gimmick, a fad that's now dead. The Wii U's gimmickthe GamePad—just isn't a console-selling feature. After the holiday spike of 2012, the Wii U came crashing down in January with only 46,000 hardware units sold. And let's not forget that the Wii began downtrending during the last few years of its existence; the Wii U is in danger of doing this much sooner.

Some might point to the 3DS and how successful it is despite people hating on its lack of launch software, but there's a major difference: The 3DS has weak competition. It doesn't even need to try against the Vita. Contrast this to the Wii U, whose fate will ultimately be the third wheel to the PlayStation 4 and next Xbox 360 console.

Who will praise the Wii U's "last-gen" graphics in two years? Who will care about a GamePad when the PS4 has Remote Play? Who will talk about Miiverse when Microsoft's and Sony's cloud services define online connectivity and make game streaming a reality?

Only 34,000 pieces of Wii U software were sold in the UK in January and that includes the bundled Nintendoland. That's fewer than the Vita's 46,000 software units in the same period. Tragic. And of the titles alledgedly in production for Wii U, an unhealthy portion of them will be ports.

Can anyone rationally believe that Wii U will succeed when it has to spread out its first-party franchises and passable third-party support over the next six years? Heck, console generations are getting longer, so why not the next ten years? Nintendo can only pump out a handful of triple-A first-party titles a year. Even if they are amazing titles, is that enough to sustain a console? The Wii U's long-term future is certainly in doubt.


Daniel Bischoff - NO: Nick, Nick, there's a reason people are pointing to the 3DS, but it isn't to compare the handheld markets with the console markets. It's because the ever-dominating Nintendo handheld will carry the company through waters both calm and rough, a beacon in the storm. Iwata and company can rely on that steady growth to push development on the Wii U and make it a fantastic console.

Both you and I agree that the Wii was a console people owned along with a PS3 or 360. The Wii U can be the same thing. In fact, it's already appearing to trend that way. The recently revealed Dualshock 4 has a touch-sensitive area, but we don't know what it is. Nintendo designed their console to compliment the competition which is clearly more interested in an abundance of power (PS4) or, if rumors are true, the casual, entertainment-leaning market (Next Xbox).

Nintendo is a risk taker, and the 3DS is proof of that. Despite the gimmicky 3D effect, people who pick the console up with a core game find so much to love. I've often related the fun I have with my 3DS to the joy associated only with the Nintendo 64.

Yes, even the 3DS is the answer for your software and sales woes. Nintendo has been here. They have the money in the bank to take and react to these things. As they did with the 3DS, Miyamoto will put that replica Master Sword to good use and slash the hardware price or pack in an extra game.

Next-gen console prices will soar, but I hope Microsoft or Sony come close to competing with the Wii U's $300 tag. It'll only encourage Nintendo to do what it does best: play to your biggest sympathies. These are timeless characters and excellent games in their own right.

Just wait until you see the first original Zelda title in HD. See where Mario goes next. Try to resist the impossible blend of Shin Megami Tensei and Fire Emblem. The 3DS is the workhorse in this relationship; more amazing Nintendo games are on their way.



Anthony Severino - YES (Rebuttal): Silly, Daniel! We're not talking about the 3DS here. Though it shows that Nintendo can turn things around, the circumstances are very different with the Wii U.

The Wii U is struggling, contrary to the 3DS, due to lack of software and a clear message from Nintendo. What is it that the Wii U does, exactly? How is it better or different from other consoles or even the Wii before it? What, the GamePad? It's a screen trying to pawn itself off as a tablet. It’s not portable and doesn’t run apps on its own. If it’s not clicking with other developers, this dry spell of support will continue.

Unlike the 3DS's gimmick, the GamePad is central to the Wii U experience. You just can’t turn it off. So comparing the Wii U’s current struggles to the 3DS and thinking it’s going to work itself out is just wishful thinking.

Whereas the 3DS's only competition is the struggling PlayStation Vita, the Wii U released in its own middle-generation, sandwiched between the PS3 and Xbox 360, which have massive install bases and huge libraries, and the PS4 and the next Xbox, which will surely have both superior content and hardware. Developers will have difficulty scaling projects down to work on the Wii U. Even worse, it doesn’t have the Wii's initial leap in install base and hype.

While Nintendo can support the console alone, the Wii U doesn't have that ace up its sleeve like the Wii's motion controls. As for online gaming, it's playing catch up with the PSN and Xbox LIVE of 2007. When personalization and cloud-integration arrives, it will make the Wii U’s service look like some poor schlep sending smoke signals to his friends to start an online game together. It's fucking archaic.

Nintendo released Wii U too late for this gen and with not enough power for next gen. It was in trouble before it was ever released. And now its competition are beginning to show their hand, that danger has become ever more clear and apparent.




Alex Osborn - NO (Rebuttal): Instead of rambling on about the handheld market, which is clearly not the topic of conversation, let's look at Nintendo's console history. I'm sure you'd agree with the fact that the Wii U is quite possibly headed toward a similar future as the GameCube, which in my humble opinion is far from troubling.

The debate at hand is whether or not the Wii U's future is in trouble and while, yes, there are more powerful consoles on the horizon and, yes, the Wii U will almost certainly have lackluster third-party support, you can't underestimate the power of the company's first-party franchises. Anthony, you said it yourself: "Nintendo can support the console alone." So why would the Wii U be in trouble? 

The crux of your argument is based on the presupposition that the Wii U needs to compete with the PS4 and next Xbox. That couldn't be further from the truth. Nintendo doesn't want to compete with Sony and Microsoft, and they proved that with the Wii. Sure, the GamePad may not be as compelling of a gimmick, but that's not what made the Wii great anyway. Gamers and casual fans alike want more Mario and more Zelda, and the only place to get that is on Nintendo's platform.

We're still incredibly early on in the Wii U's life, so painting a picture of doom and gloom only a few months after its release is a bit asinine if you ask me. Nintendo has a new 3D Mario title in the works, a brand-new Zelda (not to mention a remake of Wind Waker), Super Smash Bros. 4, and no doubt some other surprises as well. Will the Wii U win the next-gen console war? Probably not, but that doesn't mean the platform is in trouble either.


Comments
  • Jonathan_Leack
    Jonathan_Leack

    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:02 pm
    I'm already sick of mine. Now I just use it to watch League of Legends pro games since its browser and virtual keyboard rock.
  • damo_rox619
    damo_rox619

    Joined: Jan 2007
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:05 pm
    I'm in a similar situation. I have 4 wii u games but once I finished ac3 I just went straight back to my ps3 and 360. I only use my wii u for miiverse now
  • xDUMPWEEDx
    xDUMPWEEDx

    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 11:29 am
    On launch night neither one of us thought the software support would dry up like the Sahara. Sucks man. All you can really do now is just keep it for the rare first party title and buy yourself a PS4 for everything else.
  • blake_peterson
    blake_peterson

    Joined: Oct 2011
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 2:46 pm
    Perhaps I'm jaded, but waiting for first party/console exclusives is virtually the only reason I buy any console. I've found that I buy cross-platform games less and less, and when I do I am more disappointed with the results (with exceptions like Fallout: New Vegas filling in here and there).

    However, if you asked me what my favorite games of the last console generation were, they might look like this:

    The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings (PC port to XBox 360)
    The Last Story (Wii Exclusive)
    Uncharted 2 (PS3 Exclusive)
    Super Mario 3D Land (3DS Exclusive)
    Ni No Kuni (PS3 Exclusive)
    Metal Gear Solid: Peacewalker (PSP exclusive, later ported to XBox, PS3)
    Valkyria Chronicles (PS3 Exclusive)
    Ratchet and Clank Future: A Crack in Time (PS3 Exclusive)

    So far I've loved both Nintendoland and New Super Mario Bros U. My one exception, so far, is how much I adored Batman: Arkham City on the Wii U, and can't imagine playing it on another console due to the use of the Gamepad.
  • damo_rox619
    damo_rox619

    Joined: Jan 2007
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:04 pm
    There were some great points brought up in this article, well done guys. Though its not very exciting to read "just wait till the next Zelda and mario." Can these two franchises really keep Nintendo afloat through yet another generation? Especially considering the wii U seems to be heading to a similar fate as the dreamcast?

    As for my opinion, the wii u is in big trouble. As a gamer who has gamer friends (and none of us are involved in the industry), I know from first hand experience that the game pad gimmick is a failure. More than a few times I have heard the phrase "so... What does it do?" I explain the features of super mario bros. and zombiu and the response I get is usually along the lines of "oh..... That doesn't sound very good."

    Add to that the weak hardware and lack of 3rd party support, nintendo's only hope really is Zelda and mario, and I'm not totally convinced that two franchises can sustain a console for an entire generation. In fact, it's seemingly impossible
  • damo_rox619
    damo_rox619

    Joined: Jan 2007
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:04 pm
    I apologise for the long post
  • Nick_Tan
    Nick_Tan

    Joined: Jul 2006
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:05 pm
    No prob. We love long, thorough posts!
  • Ivory_Soul
    Ivory_Soul

    Joined: Nov 2005
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 12:18 pm
    Nick likes 'em long and thorough! You heard it first here folks!
  • sliverstorm
    sliverstorm

    Joined: Jun 2007
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:25 pm
    The Wii U's launch year beat both the Xbox 360 and the PS3 launch years haNDILY, so I'm not ready to take one month and call it dead... but it does seem kinda dead, at least conceptually. The structure and services just aren't next-gen, and once again Nintendo has excluded themselves from third party support. Nick and Anthony get my vote.
  • sg4real
    sg4real

    Joined: Apr 2011
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:33 pm
    The Wii U doesn't have enough good exclusive games so far, I know its still early but most of the games out for it we've already played it on ps3 or 360. Also, now that the PS4 as been announced and Next Xbox coming, who would put 300$+ on a Wii U when you can put it towards a real next gen console?
  • 213EDD
    213EDD

    Joined: Sep 2007
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 6:41 pm
    Uhh... Wut
  • Longo_2_guns
    Longo_2_guns

    Joined: Jun 2003
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 7:01 pm
    Anthony needs to fix his avatar again. It's doing the Admin glitch.

    Though Alex and Nick have this same problem in the forums.
  • Nick_Tan
    Nick_Tan

    Joined: Jul 2006
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 11:55 pm
    Thanks for catching this! It's been fixed. Not sure how to amend this on the forums, though... hermmmm....
  • Longo_2_guns
    Longo_2_guns

    Joined: Jun 2003
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 12:48 am
    It has to do with your avatars trying to load through the admin panel rather than through the normal site. When you changed it, did you use the normal profile settings or did you go through a special administrator board? Because yours and Alex's avatars are coming from admin . gamerevolution rather than www . gamerevolution, which is why it brings up the "admin log in" screen every time.
  • sandineyes
    sandineyes

    Joined: May 2008
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 3:51 pm
    The problem yet exists on this page, possibly due to Alex's avatar, which doesn't seem to load.
  • xDUMPWEEDx
    xDUMPWEEDx

    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 7:03 pm
    Wii U has been completely off my radar ever since the PS4 reveal. Wii U could easily be another Gamecube. I am fairly certain that once this generation is over the Wii U will be a distant third behind Xbox 3 and PS4.
  • Longo_2_guns
    Longo_2_guns

    Joined: Jun 2003
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 7:19 pm
    Also, in regards to the Wii U going like the Game Cube, I agree, but not in a good way. That's because the difference between the Wii U and the Game Cube is that by one month, the Game Cube had SSB:M, within a half year they also had Super Mario Sunshine, and a little more than a year after launch they had Wind Waker as well. Not to mention it wasn't long before a Game Cube cost a measly 100 dollars.

    The Wii U is selling like the Game Cube would've had it not had any of those games and cost 300 dollars. Really, the Wii U is in trouble NOW, but it has potential to grow.
  • TheJx4
    TheJx4

    Joined: Jun 2011
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 7:35 pm
    "See where Mario goes next."

    Absolutely nowhere.
  • wildmario
    wildmario

    Joined: Jan 2007
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 8:11 pm
    Didn't the Wii have a similar slow start?


    Call me stupid, but based on history, perhaps the Wii-U struggling is a blessing in disguise. The N64 and GC sold quite badly compared to the PS1 and PS2, yet everyone will always bring up a ton of games they played on the N64 and GC. Perhaps it is happening again here.
  • Longo_2_guns
    Longo_2_guns

    Joined: Jun 2003
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 8:47 pm
    Not really. The Wii U had better launch sales than the Wii, but after that the Wii pretty much trumpeted out in terms of numbers sold whereas the Wii U numbers keep dropping.
  • Ivory_Soul
    Ivory_Soul

    Joined: Nov 2005
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 8:51 pm
    Just bad timing. Nintendo was too impatient to be first out of the gate this time instead of last. I think with the PS4 announcement and the Xbox 720 in April people will quickly forget about the WiiU (the rest who already haven't) I laughed at everyone who bought a WiiU on day one and said they would regret it. Of course they called me an idiot and (insert company name) fanboy, and "I don't understand". A few have already traded in their WiiU, it's collecting dust, or they stuck it in a closet.
  • wildmario
    wildmario

    Joined: Jan 2007
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 9:39 pm
    I don't know if Nintendo jumped the gun too soon, especially since the Wii with in the past 2 years started to slow in sales and Nintendo needed something to get back in the game, which is the Wii U and 3DS. Honestly, I don't think Nintendo could survive on the Wii alone right now if the Wii-U wasn't released.
  • Ivory_Soul
    Ivory_Soul

    Joined: Nov 2005
    Posted: Mar 1st, 2013 at 8:53 pm
    Honestly the last good Nintendo console was the N64. I never owned a GC, sold my Wii about a year after I bought it, and while I like the WiiU's hardware, I can't justify a $350 purchase unless I see better games that aren't Mario, Zelda, Metroid, or any other Nintendo IP.
  • Alex_Osborn
    Alex_Osborn

    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 8:45 am
    No GC? You missed out. :(
  • Ivory_Soul
    Ivory_Soul

    Joined: Nov 2005
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 12:17 pm
    Not really...I bought a few GC games when I owned a Wii. There weren't that many great exclusives on the GC. Not as many as the PS2 anyways.
  • Alex_Osborn
    Alex_Osborn

    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 12:30 pm
    Sure, not as many as the PS2, but certainly more than just a few. Glad you got the check them out on the Wii at least.
  • xDUMPWEEDx
    xDUMPWEEDx

    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 1:33 am
    The price of the Wii U is TOO DAMN HIGH. It needs a drastic price cut, and soon. $250 for the deluxe would be a good start.
  • Noritama
    Noritama

    Joined: Feb 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 5:07 am
    Meh, They'll probably survive. If the Sony can survive how much money the PS3 cost them when it first kicked the door I think Nintendo will be alright
  • uptown710
    uptown710

    Joined: Jun 2011
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 9:19 am
    I don't think its a issue of nintendo going under, but more like how much damage the waining Wii U sales will cause the big N in the end. As Nick has mentioned, I don't think 1 or 2 games a year is gonna keep the system afloat. Worse case scenario in my opinion, Nintendo withdraws from the hardware business.
  • cyberjim2000
    cyberjim2000

    Joined: Feb 2010
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 8:10 am
    I'm still a wait and see kind of guy. Should wait until April(?) when Nintendo releases their annual report and announce to their shareholders what strategy they're taking. My opinion, not as a Nintendo fanboy but as a business... guy...
  • cyberjim2000
    cyberjim2000

    Joined: Feb 2010
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 8:52 am
    Also, I forgot to mention. People had been predicting Nintendo's demise since the N64 days when they refused to switch to the CD format and lost a lot of exclusive games that made the Playstation a household name.
  • uptown710
    uptown710

    Joined: Jun 2011
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 9:13 am
    Im hoping and praying that you just didn't say that Nintendo(85 billion plus), is worth more than MS(247 billion plus last I recall), and Sony Combined.... Yeeeaaaaaa.... I hope the GR staff makes basic math a requirement for posting on these boards
  • cyberjim2000
    cyberjim2000

    Joined: Feb 2010
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 11:26 am
    What the **** are you talking about? I didn't say Nintendo is worth more than a company that makes the most use OS in the world or the entertainment company. Where in my post did I say that Nintendo is worth more than Sony or Microsoft. Maybe basic math skills shouldn't be a requirement but reading comprehension should.
  • uptown710
    uptown710

    Joined: Jun 2011
    Posted: Mar 3rd, 2013 at 12:07 am
    The person whom my comment was directed towards has had their post removed sir.
  • cyberjim2000
    cyberjim2000

    Joined: Feb 2010
    Posted: Mar 3rd, 2013 at 3:53 am
    Ah, my apologies then.
  • wildmario
    wildmario

    Joined: Jan 2007
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 9:20 am
    Anyone else getting a pop up saying to log in when viewing this article?
  • Chunibrow
    Chunibrow

    Joined: Mar 2010
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 9:33 am
    Someone ban this idiot. Triple posting on 3 threads in a row when it's been explained how to avoid it should be 3 strikes you're out. My guess is he does it on purpose now because he knows people don't like it.
  • cyberjim2000
    cyberjim2000

    Joined: Feb 2010
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 11:35 am
    Wait, what?
  • wildmario
    wildmario

    Joined: Jan 2007
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 11:43 am
    Uh...I am sure that wasn't to me, was it? I don't triple post.
  • elmoreoocyte
    elmoreoocyte

    Joined: Apr 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 11:43 am
    I don't see a triple post?

    Help me, Chuni. I want to rage too.
  • cyberjim2000
    cyberjim2000

    Joined: Feb 2010
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 11:53 am
    You know what I think it was? stealth2k made a post(s) and his posts got deleted and comments replied to him went to different comments.
  • Chunibrow
    Chunibrow

    Joined: Mar 2010
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 9:07 pm
    That is exactly what happened. Wildmario you had the unfortunate comment placement directly above stealth2k's posts to have mine linked to it after his got deleted. I hope he got banned too. Mother****er.
  • SolidSevchinko78
    SolidSevchinko78

    Joined: Jun 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 10:03 am
    I was seriously considering getting a Wii U, but with announcement of the PS4, I putting my money towards it. I was really excited for the Wii U, but after it's been out and there really hasn't been any new game releases, it reminds of when I bought a Wii at launch in 2006. It had a decent launch library of games(mostly ports of games that were already on other systems) and then during the early months of 2007 there was a huge drought of games. Yeah there some releases but it was mostly shovelware looking to capitalize on the motion controls. Now its 2013 and I see the same thing for the Wii U. Why does Nintendo do this crap? Its ridiculous how there is no new software being steadily available for the Wii U. They promise new first party titles for the system, but only will give vague details on when they will be released. Do they really expect gamers to wait months and months for their titles? Especially when there is hardly anything being released. Nintendo needs to wake up!!
  • xDUMPWEEDx
    xDUMPWEEDx

    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posted: Mar 2nd, 2013 at 11:26 am
    Nintendo messed up when it comes to third party support. The PS3/360 are still getting a continous flow of games, and the Wii U isn't getting any ports. I know Nintendo loves to be innovative, but their strategy leaves them stranded in the middle of no where.
  • johnsos7
    johnsos7

    Joined: Mar 2013
    Posted: Mar 3rd, 2013 at 2:34 pm
    I don't think it's in big trouble but Nintendo need to get it in gear before they will be. I got one for Christmas and to be honest...I play it more than my PS3. The graphics are beautiful and the game play on every game I have for it is done very well. The games I have now are: Mario, Sonic Transformed, COD Black Ops II, Ninja Gaiden, and Scribblenauts. I know three of the five are on other consoles, but they're all still a lot of fun on the Wii U. I do think things will eventually pick up for it as we go into summer and fall though with titles like Bayonetta 2 etc.

    I don't think it's going to have as rough of a time as many think when Microsoft & Sony's consoles come out. A lot of people still have a bad taste in their mouth after all the failed 360's since 2005 and have sworn off future XBox products and some people are already skeptical about Sony's machine and their policies involving games.
  • chefguy95
    chefguy95

    Joined: Apr 2013
    Posted: Apr 11th, 2013 at 12:22 pm
    The reason I bought a Wii U in the first place was because my Wii's drive failed (it's a first gen bought on release day!) and I decided to upgrade. Isn't that what it really is anyways? An upgraded Wii? I am disappointed by the weak releases since launch, but I see it as an extension of the library of games I own for the Wii, not a new system. I like the pad, my GF and I can share the T.V. we can lay in bed and she can watch Netflix or Hulu on it while I play another console. It has potential to grow even with a slow start. I am more likely to buy a system that's backwards compatible than dropping a ton of cash on a PS4 that won't run my PS3 games. I have all three systems, and honestly if it weren't for the free games on PSN I probably would never touch the PS3.

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